UFC 114 Controversy: Fightmetric Indicates Brilz The Winner Against Nogueira
by Kelvin Hunt on May 30, 2010 10:00 AM EDT
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PrintOn the fightmetric system Brilz was declared the winner. However, it was declared a draw on the ten point must system which is what he use here in America for MMA.
The fightmetric striking score was 206-143 in favor of Brilz and the grappling score was 95-45 in favor of Brilz for an overall score of 206-143 in favor of Brilz.
The first round striking was almost dead even with Nogueira landing one more strike overall. However, he landed 3 more power shots than Brilz. Both had one takedown a piece with Brilz getting to Nogueira's half guard once. The striking score was 32-24 in favor of Nogueira in the first round with the grappling score 14-5 in favor of Brilz. Which means the total for round 1 was 39-37 in favor of brilz according to fightmetric's version of scoring the fight.
I think Nogueira underperformed while Brilz overcheived(in oddsmakers eyes) thus people kind of going a little overboard with the robbery claims. It basically came down to how you scored the first round as I said last night.
As you can see it was pretty much as close as it can get. Now, if we were using the PRIDE scoring system Brilz was clearly the winner, but we are not using that method. We can only go by who wins which rounds.
Round 1 was a toss up really, while Brilz took round 2, and Nogueira took round 3.
Still think it was robbery?
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I said the same thing 3PA.
I looked over at the guys sitting next to me and said, Lil Nog wins by split dec. They all laughed and said no way. Then after the decision, they asked, how I knew it would happen. I would like to see a rematch too, after Jason has a few more fights and Lil Nog is either out of contention or champ. Jason had nothing to lose and fought like a man possessed. I agree with the decision, I believe the difference was lil nogs boxing and the crucifix. I dont remember, lil nog being put in a dominant position like that.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
IF, that is how fight metric scores fights, fightmetric is worthless. brilz didnt “get” to Nogs half guard, Little and big nog always put guys in half guard and use the helicopter sweep to start momentum for a sweep/reversal/go behind to a single, so using brilz being in half guard as a scoring mechanism…..is extremely flawed.
I had nog winning rd 1 and 3, I do think 1 was close though, and folks have to remember judges, despite being in charge of who wins a fight, often have really bad seats to determine who is doing what and when (they could be 30 feet from the action in many cases, with view of only one fighter. I think if judges had the benefit of camera angles spectators at home do, more decisions would turn out less stinky) which I have never understood. I think alot of folks dont realize the camera angle from home is in most cases a better view of the action than a judges seat or even a cornerman’s spot.
In JJ competition pulling guard counts against you in points
But may put you in a better position. Whether Nog intended for him to go into half guard is inconsequential; Brilz advanced out of full guard. It doesn’t matter why it happened, it just happened.
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Brilz won that fight. Everybody knows it. This is just another in the growing list of BS descions in the UFC.
Not a BS decision
just highlights the shortcomings of the way the 10 point must system is utilized in MMA.
I think the ten point must system works
But it’s just poor judging. You can make it so people can use 10-6 rounds freely, but when the judges can’t get the right guy winning the round, it doesn’t matter whay system it is.
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Since when does pulling guard in BJJ competition count against people in pts? I know the rules are in flux, but when exactly did that one come about?
As for Nog putting him in half guard, well he did it to sweep or reverse, which he did quite a bit……so “advance” is not the word to use, and last I checked you for sure dont get any pts in BJJ for “advancing” to half guard, advantage maybe, but heck I wouldnt even bank on that one.
As for “everyone” knowing Brilz won……no alot of folks realize the 10 pt must is what it is, and under that system the fight was exactly what it was, very close, with one guy winning on a split decision. I accept for sure a case where brilz could have won on the scorecards, that’s what a split decision means, it was close, but, not in any way a picture of domination as folks attempt to pain talking about “clear” wins.
I don’t know when, that’s just what I’ve seen when watching competition. And these are legit points on a legit scoreboard; it counts as a deduction in points against the dude who pulled guard.
Well I can’t say whether half guard counts as advanceing or not, but this ain’t a BJJ competition. I made the pulling guard reference because like in MMA, it’s a tactical move that counts against you which may improve your position.
I hate how people get down on the 10 point must system. Whether it’s flawed or not isn’t important, because when used correctly it’s fine. Brillz won the first round; he maintained dominant position, out-grappled Nog, and striking was practically even. The thing is that split decisions shoudn’t happen; saying it’s “close” doesn’t make up for it, because at least one judge still got the wrong decision, but it’s made up for by the fact there’s a third judge. Especially in this case, if Nog was on the bottom going for legit sub attempts or at least striking from the bottom it would be different, but this was Brilz putting him down and keeping him there, and staying exceptional competitive against a guy many people wanted to win for 12ish minutes.
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perhaps you should rewatch the fight, because Brilz didnt do anything with top position, other than lose it to nog going back and forth between helicopter sweep and the back door reversal.
As for losing pts for pulling guard, what competion (bJJ) did you see this happen in? You also realize, pulling guard, isnt the same as getting taken down and ending up in guard.
I agree its not BJJ, but its not wrestling either, if you dont do something to inflict damage or finish, you shouldnt be rewarded. Had nog not been working to reverse the whole time in the 1st, I dont think much of a fight would have happened. The 10 pt must was used correctly, at least I had it scored for nog in Rd 1 and 3, of course its subjective, but no matter what the 1st rd was close enough to go either way.
A simple fix, is to finish the fight, dont let judges decide. I have met a few judges, and let me tell you, YOU DO NOT want them deciding your fate in a fight, very, very few of them have ANY combat sports background, and are usually pals with someone in state gov, who went to a training course for a few hours and are now getting checks to judge fights.
See the reply button? Use it.
I’m well aware of the difference between getting dumped on your ass, and jumping into guard and pulling someone down, thanks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFons3q7qUM
I rewatched the video, and I still say it’s close, but I also still say that Brilz won the round. Reversals and sweeps are great, but Nog did less with the position he got than what Brilz did when he was on top, so that should tell you something.
Man, this “don’t let it go to the judges” stuff is bullshit. It’s an excuse to make up for bad judging, which even you admitted. Like I said on the review show Saturday night, if you take your car to a shop to get work done and they bust it up, it’s not your fault for taking it there, it’s their fault for breaking it. Yeah, letting bad judges determine the outcome is a bad idea for the fighters, but it’s an even worse idea to employ these bad judges in the first place.
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